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Javelin Assault Missiles graph

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Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.11.25 12:02:00 - [1] Graph Pros * Extreamly superior range * Superior damage. Cons * Delayed first hit (no insta popping frigates) Balanced? --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.11.26 11:15:00 - [2] Originally by: Rod Blaine Is that graph made witht he amopunt of turret/launcher point each ship ahs in mind ? If so then those javs definately need a heavy nerf yes, in both range as well as damage. No, the Drake has gotten an additional launcher since then. It now has 7 launchers and the graph shows the dps with 6. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.11.26 11:23:00 - [3] Edited by: Jim McGregor on 26/11/2006 11:25:23 Originally by: Verus Potestas Originally by: Rod Blaine Is that graph made witht he amopunt of turret/launcher point each ship ahs in mind ? If so then those javs definately need a heavy nerf yes, in both range as well as damage. First, yes, hardpoints taken into consideration. However, the Drake only has 6 in that pic. Second, they have had their range cut severely (about a half) and about 5% damage lost. The extra launcher should give Drake +14% dps in the graph, so even if you take away 5% from the nerf, its still insane. But i'll make a new graph with the correct numbers. It wont be any better though. They shouldnt go further than maybe 20 km, or they should have much lower dps. Close combat weapon or long range weapon, ccp decides, but they cant have them both high damage and long range. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.11.26 11:29:00 - [4] Originally by: Aramendel When you make a new graph please add an harbringer with 7 heavy pulse 2 and conflag to it so we have an comparsion to the shortrange weapon system with the next highest range. Aye, will do. Just have to get on the test server and have a look at the new numbers. Ill post it later today. :) --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.11.26 12:22:00 - [5] I updated the graph and I still dont like what im seeing here... --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.11.26 12:32:00 - [6] Edited by: Jim McGregor on 26/11/2006 12:37:24 Originally by: Aramendel Originally by: Jim McGregor I updated the graph and I still dont like what im seeing here... Uuups, sorry Jim, I gave you the wrong crystal, scortch, not conflag. I confused the short and longrange pulse laser crystals. Ok, fixed it. :) But why not use heavy beams? Then you have the range of the artillery ships, but crappy damage just like the rest of us. You have about 30 dps more than the artillery hurricane and the railgun brutix if you use those, but javelins still run us all over. Originally by: Lucian Corvinus Originally by: Jim McGregor I updated the graph and I still dont like what im seeing here... Could you try one where the myrmidon has it's 5 ogre II deployed I wouldn't mind shorter range and 90 in damage again.. No, because then this thread will be taken over by gallente players arguing the myrmidon is balanced... --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.11.26 13:25:00 - [7] Edited by: Jim McGregor on 26/11/2006 13:26:39 Originally by: Aramendel But if you compare it vs the harb it gets obvious that a 30k range for them - as some people suggested - would be too low. One of 40-45k seems decent to me, it gives it a reasonable range where it outdamages the harbringer and gives longrange weapons a decent window where they outdamage the javs. I dont know... if they had a range of 40-45k, I would never use medium artillery. The delayed damage of 6-7 seconds in the beginning of the fight is nothing, and alpha strike doesnt mean anything with the increased hitpoints. Missiles catch up very fast. And then you have all the other advantages of missiles with consistent damage and no misses. So I would use the Drake. Much better tanking than the other battlecruisers, and much better dps as well, at medium range (20k to 45k or whatever ccp thinks is fair). Its simply the absolute best choice if this goes live. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.11.26 14:31:00 - [8] Originally by: welsh wizard Do you think that a missile ship that moves at approximately 50m/s, has no capacity to fit an mwd/web and has a maximum weapon range of 30km with an average - high damage payload balanced? I'd appreciate it if someone could answer that. I think 30 km would be a balanced max range for Javelins, yeah. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.11.26 15:04:00 - [9] Edited by: Jim McGregor on 26/11/2006 15:06:45 Originally by: Lucian Corvinus I know Jim is trying to show how underpowered the hurrican is compared to the drake and the others new BCs. But what I don't understand is why he 'forgot' to use the last 2 highslots on the hurricane for launchers?? The drake can't fit a turret in the last highslot but the huricane can fit 2 missile launchers. I would also really like if he could keep the transversal velocity, the radius and the velocity for the target so we can see what those stats are. I would like these graphs to be fair and not just an excuse to rant away Drake is overpowered with Javelins compared to every other battlecruiser in the game with their best medium range guns. The reason I dont put launchers on a Hurricane with 720's is that then you can forget about any sort of tank on it. Fit 6 720's and you are out of powergrid. Add reactor controls and you can put some launchers on it, but you have no tank at all. That should be set in relation to the Drake, which can fit a mean tank while also having the best dps in this league of weapons. Im not trying to show a false picture here. I belive it to be very accurate. As for your transversal velocity, it wont affect this situation because speed only affects missiles when you travel REALLY fast, and you cant do that with railgun/artillery ships because then your tracking makes you miss everything. Tracking is something that guns have and missiles dont you know. This graph is the PERFECT situation for turrets with nobody moving. If anything, turret dps will be lower in reality if the ships arent standing still. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate

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